Enough~ Ban on Dual Boxing~

both of sides have partially right.

please do not try to convince each other to one's right as it will lead to "teh dark side".

dualboxing is and will be a non-written feature (or issue) of the world of lineage ii and it's better to get over it. the last thing is to send message to korea

besides, there is possibility to have 1 dualbox per 1 premium account so it's kind of limitation.

regards

 

the best option would be 1 dualbox per person rather than premium account, in my opinion of course. (other than eliminating dual boxing permanently)

 

so your problem is premium? as vikea said always in party room people search for healers-iss etc.
i rarely see box in partys except some hours of deep night.

 

i've stated what i think is wrong, it's not premium but dual boxing.

what we have is people challenging content intended for more; characters shared between them and related. if this was indeed intended by the developers we would be able to control more characters within one game client; dual boxing is something ncsoft knows exists but apparently refuses to directly address it, reading previous interviews i've never seen someone ask them that question.

 

you lost somewhere i think. as an active iss you will never have any problem to find a party to xp up, get cp etc. i never had. also as the others mentioned in some situations most of the ppl need an iss box. farm alone at night, get buff everywhere etc. there was a period when the server was full of iss (mostly active ones) and was hard to find parties as an iss but those times are passed. people know having an active iss is much better and faster for any party. i don't get why you have a problem with dualboxing. especially dualboxing an iss. you are trying to go against a 10 years old game mechanics anyway. box a char always was a part of l2.

 

to be honest - i don't know why you see problem especially in god
bd,sws,wc,ol,pp combined into one class... in pre-god it was really hard to make 9ppl party and some classess was just for picking up drops and only buff every 20 minutes :d.
anyway, maya you wrote in other topics, that you are aware that innova isn't developer, whats more you acted like it was an obvious thing and we dummies dare to question it... so how do you want to force innova to *ekhm* delete dualboxing which is actually part of a game, i'd say its a part of most grind-based mmo. even if it would be impossible to run 2nd copy of l2, whats the problem to get 2nd laptop/pc? i guess you'd write smth like one person/per one ip :>? btw. how do you know if ncsoft didn't have intention to support dualboxing? i mean from bussiness point-of-view dualbox was even more desired before f2p era. every "live" player could buy another account. i want only remind you, that l2 used to be p2p game with buy-in accountkey and monthly subscription. if you want to get closer to intentions of game designers or ncsoft as studio you can always dig in rochand forum and check some unofficial information or rumors about l2 as a game and where it goes.
*little flame*
sure - every1 can share their opinion, idea, but i can see that this topic lasts for a far too long with this "idea". i don't have anything against you, but (correct me if i'm wrong) you are fresh player in core and one of your first topic is about changing fundamental part of a game ... i mean seriously, wtf :d

maybe lets start another topic like ban ppl who uses nostromo,g15 bcos keyboard plays for them!
or more related to game - lets ban yuls archers who break doors on castle sieges with just arrows (not rpg at all!)
or what the heck - just delete castle sieges.

 

the limitation to physical computers is already quite stringent and very effective in fighting dual boxing.

ncsoft didn't have the intention for dual boxing as accounts (originally, probably still today) are linked to your social security number in korea - one account per person maximum. nckorea's version of lineage2 is the most "native" you can get. so as to answer the question maya also refered to as being never asked to the developers - it is by the rules that in korea the accounts are strictly bound to the person, and no two accounts exist. it is therefore that if one leaves the game and wants to "share" the character, korea has certain services to put the character on another account.

 

flames have no place in a suggestions border; i recommend you to edit it out.

innova is capable of stopping dual boxing just like they're capable of stopping bots more effectively, as it stands now someone can virtually log an entire clan by paying for such an amount of pa accounts. i am not asking the game to have an in-game anti-dual boxing system, i just would like innova to have the stance of "one person can only play a single character at the same time" and that, my sweetie, is this topic's goal.

i can't confirm what reckless says besides the korean id part which is true; but if the korean community is entitled by the game's rules to only be allowed to own one account and that account must be linked to themselves. the game is still being developed with that in mind.

the instances, party sizes and related will all be taken into consideration when designing new content; "this has a 10% drop rate, we should make this a 14-people dungeon!" for example. dual boxing allows us to exploit those decisions and limit the acquirement of rewards to a small number of people, maybe even a single one rather than having to count on other 13-people that would be willing to concede the rewards for themselves. (once again, refering to the specific example i just stated)

i wanted to avoid talking about iss enchanters being used as alt+tabbing buffers because:

• i am one myself(easy for adhominem fallacy)
• it is the most common usage for dual boxing but not the only one.

so please if you'll answer this topic, tackle the issue as a whole rather than just the iss enchanters' case unless you have something to add specifically for that. you cannot, in a discussion, tackle a part of the issue and then come up with a conclusion for the whole. that's not logical.

 

i hope you guys don't belive that koreans have any limitations to dualboxes, accounts. officially maybe. easily bypassable probably. i think everyone knows they are the ones who farm, bot more than anyone else. actually botting require dualbox or triple and so on. and well, if you able to do 14 ppl instance with 7 ppl + boxes then why just don't do that way? i don't get it. actually anyone able to do that. where is the problem? cuz you won't find party because most of the ppl wanna share drops or so with less ppl? isn't that normal? if i could do an instance alone or do anything else why i would invite others to reduce my chances? no logic in that. there comes a point where you have mostly everything or even you are far from top and you can help anyone who needs it. but until then that's totally normal to try to maximize your chances for rewards.

i can give you a lot example about dualboxing is better than using an active player to fill a slot. a failed a lot instance with a so "active" player. most of the ppl don't even have brain so more chances to fail an instance. like fail epic spez, fortuna or octavis. very easy to fail them if there is one noob in the party and they are mostly don't listen to any command or advice. in that way why i wanna risk octavis with 14 ppl if i can do safer with 7 ppl + boxes and also don't have to share rewards only with 6 ppl then. killing time is the same. mostly smarter and/or better geared ppl are going to make instances with boxes so equal safer, they all know their jobs. and clanmembers or cp members or friends are doing in that way even randoms. where is the problem seriously?

 

the question was whether this game was designed with dual boxing in mind, and whether such behaviour was the intention of the creators. the kssn fraud and other techniques used nowadays do not have any implications on this matter.

as to the second point of your post - experience grows with players when they can play more. if they are slowly replaced by boxes, they will never learn. failing octavis or whatever one time is part of the game, and that is the mindset of l2 in korea - play together, not egoistic. this was also reflected on the bonusses people were given when they used the auto-party system - a new player in the party would be automatically assigned which is then summoned directly to the party. i believe for a certain number of minutes, a xp/sp bonus (perhaps in terms of vit, perhaps in terms of direct xp) was given out when using this system. the use of randoms in parties is therefore much higher, there are less cps - especially considering some servers were fully pve.

 

i think only guys who are iss enchanters agree with you or the ones who have no boxes... ^^

 

so generally, your vision is that l2 (or server) should become more like kindergarten. this is the moment when clan system is introduced. this auto-summoning/replace thing was pretty good @ beginning, when server was full of low levels and there wasn't that much wars, but after some time it was kinda useless things, especially when parties started to abuse it - like click for a replace, get vitality, kick new person, inv back old one.
about l2 in korea - i admit - my bad, i don't have knowledge about korean l2, i've only played on ncwest and innova servers, so i pass the discussion about intentions of developers, bcos it involves a lot of history, changes in developer teams, directions of l2 generally and etc. etc., but imo there is a thick line between "our" l2 (ncwest, eu) and korean. and there must be something, bcos if you read closely a disccusion on forum, you'll see that gms asked korean developers to not lower drop rate in ertheia. we also cannot play on korean servers and they cannot play on ours (i remember long time there were even ip restrictions).

@maya
as i said banning fundamental part of a game which has strong roots in game history (ok - in na/eu version) is same as banning some other stuff that i mention. you can spare me those fancy quotes about exposure of my "flame" tactics, bcos for me those examples had same level of ridiculousness as this whole "ban boxes".
about isses - well its the only true class that has a point in being dualboxed. in god every exp spot is always more effective if whole party is alive. i remember that i used to exp with semi-afk ppl (not bots actually) in old it (l room). party had 9 ppl, 3 archers, 1 archer was ma and others just had clicker spam, no bots, no dualboxes, just ppl who were able to cook dinner/read book/w/e and look into monitor once for 10minutes. now dualboxes(excepts isses and plvling) are used to enter instances and it has sense, bcos clan/cps party doesn't have to invite total random ppl or wars if they don't want to...

anyway, time for me - i feel like i'm loosing time here, bcos no arguments can convince you and no arguments will convince me and as razzly said - both sides have its rights - so good luck in idea.

 

my opinion is not of any issue here, as we're talking about the developer's motivations on l2. also, no, i do not play an iss but a dd. but to give you a hint of my personal ideas on this: it's indeed hard to change this at this stage, possibly even too late. nonetheless, we already saw an attempt to regulate the boxing at ncwest, by their miserable implementation of a max-3-boxes limitation.

the party matching system was introduced around the time of gracia final / high five-times. keep in mind that most of the population in korea was already quite end-game when this system was introduced - it was introduced to further accomodate new players to prevent the (inevitable) downfall of players.

 

you just mentioned cases where content designed for more people is being challenged by less lowering the need to rely on others which is one of the things this game is about.

 

most top ppl gonna stick to their cps or at least clan mates and they wont care about clanless or ppl in random pve clans. it is much better to join at least such pve clan than tryhard solo. for me looking from past i see how dualboxing was important part of this game. we wanted kill some bosses? so with 4 ppl we were logging everything included few extra rhapsodies and sk for pain in shilen. basicly if we wanted play 100% efective and get huge income it was impossible to avoid boxing sometime 4-5 chars ofc everytime for pve, but it happened not only once we boxed some iss for pvp too (vide some my frapses).

at least i am happy in aa boxing doesnt rly exist. yes i could find reason to play at same time on two acounts but i dont see special uber epic reason like in l2 to do it. basicly 99,9% players gonna play with only their 1 main char, not even several chars on same acount since u can have all classes on same character : )

 

aha. also dont forget to ban all who create 2nd char in same account...

 

you're all taking this for granted; if you want to play with four people then play with four characters rather than 8. the reasons for such have been explained twice in this topic already.

only if you keep your useless posts to yourself.

 

sorry. but what answer you want? probably you come here from random private server with stupid rules like no boxing. no ramping, no qq. etc. and now qq ban all who box.. usually i have 2-3 windows open. so what? and i will tell you why boxing is good.
a) not every time your "cp members" can be online. so if you want go xp/sp at 2-3am what you do? log iss box and go
b) not every time your party member is online during clan events, and if you miss something it's np to box him (ok now this goes to acc sharing and other nonsense, well as i udenrstand it's np to share your account, just in case of scam you wont get help from staff)
c) explain me mister how you can /buy some things what you need. like crystals or other stuff and play same time with your main? so you log market toon and set shop.
d) if your pc with citizen calculator processor and can't handle even 1 window why you offering stupid things?
e) as i understand this is just qq why peoples box isses and not invite live ones. well i can explain you.. sometimes boxed iss is much better than live one who go afk, not listening in ts/mumble/vt/rc o w/e voice program you use. even didn't read chat. for pvp its different thing. but this is pve server. so boxed iss 90% times > live player

enough? or want more?

 

this is not a discussion on how dual boxing can benefit people.

it's how it's not intended by design and it's an exploit people simply got too used to and no one will take a stand.

a ban to dual boxing differs greatly from a ban to players that use it.

which avoids someone partying up with a random iss or seeing clan hall buffs as viable as i've previously stated, read the topic.

then at that time "your" party member will be out because he/she was not online~ like it should happen.

i'm not a mister; you shouldn't be able to, time spent marketing and leveling are two different things that shouldn't be doable simultaneously; once again if such a feature was intended we would be able to control more than one character with one game client.

are you going to keep up flaming on the feedback area? my specs:

i'm honestly worried about what i can and can't run! oh my gosh!

nope, you're absolutely wrong.

here let me help you:

we also tackled on how the developers mindset might be regarding upcoming content and challenging already released content with less people than originally intended.

 

i start to have feeling sorry for you btw. i suggest you write to the koreans, ncsoft, let's change how things work since 10 years then. and noone had a problem with dualboxes since now. if you don't understand easy stuffs why a dualbox needed or triple or anything then pointless to discuss or argue here. especially no point to discuss this with innova.

anyway since they allowing dualboxing how can be that an exploit. sorry but you misunderstand things and want to force your thoughts to others. i don't really care you accept this fact or not. i think who read your comments can see this.

other thing: people will never prefer a random iss for a cp or clan stuffs or make a 2 members party for xp/sp. why so hard to understand this seriously? yeah koreans made some areas to be able to farm with less party members. means with friends or boxes. i can tell you they know about dualboxing. they really do, and as you can see they prefer it also support it... understand and accept it please and move on.