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Let's talk

Discussion in '2011 ~ 2017' started by CM Fragola, Apr 11, 2017.

  1. is1sis1s

    is1sis1s User

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    i have never played this chronicles so i dont feel left behind with other regions like other people, but i can understand them, so the question most people want to have answered is when we are getting the update

    in a world of l2 people always want and will want exp events and enchant events thats classic, and ofc some cosmetics


    the best way of communicating is ofc this place and facebook, i found out ramona exists from there and the videos you posted, you should be giving players information every week imo

    blog could be a good idea if you can keep it active, i doubt it tho, still need to repost it on facebook
     
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2017
  2. MrOurk

    MrOurk User

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    I would like to ask something related to Innova Team and community that I think it's better to do it here instead of opening a new post.

    Would Innova be open minded into sending feedback to koreans on possible game changes to make the game more attractive to players if the content was discussed properly and the given reasons were properly argumented? Like how to make people to have more reasons to pvp, making it easier for new people to catch up, new ideas that could be implemented and so on. I know there was some try like this in RU community with really good suggestions but at some given point it stopped all out of a sudden

    Examples: Drops discussion / Instances vs open world / PvP amount increase / How to attract a bigger amount of players to servers, etc
     
  3. Aboriginal

    Aboriginal User

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    It's a good idea because I hope Innova realise that this is maybe an official server, but it's not a Korean server where developers releasing new patches next day. Which contains viral updates in gameplay such as farming, chances of growth of new players + they keep excited players by updating it so fast. And we get what they already had years ago and it's outdated gameplay content and for sure critical to gameplay since all of us playing on old patches containing many bugs and lack of game opportunities comparing to real-time patches it's sad but true. Core had a great lunch because it was nice chronicle back in the days, but you can clearly see that all those years players were decreasing and not increasing at all. Whatever reasons there are that they don't disclose to us opening a new server when you don't even have first server growing in activity will lead to merge. And the reason is that majority of people leaving the game not because Innova *****, but game making people leave. The game is not a balanced game is too much nerfed and too expensive to play if you want to get items. And if developers can't make any kind of alternatives then even no matter how hard you would advertise game will make people quit the game and on top of that Innova, l2store will push the process even faster. I see after some years Innova decided to bring dimensional sieges but is it worth? since that requires two servers and the majority of core players switch to ramona because of online drop some people decided to leave also. In server majority of people are having a lot of items and for new players to try to compete them is impossible without putting at least 10 thousand of euros each so what's the point for new players to play on core? my question what can you offer to them? People are also buying new computers and getting pathetic performance from the game because of its dusty engine. People are being already sceptical about this game on Europe regions because simply is not matching real-time content and we are pictured as Lineage 2 testers some kind of people that play old chronicles as in experimental mode to report game issues for Korean developers. If NCSoft and Innova have partnership why NCSoft is failing to provide for official servers real-time content? Is NCSoft being unprofessional? Why it takes so long to translate and deliver the content? Even patch notes takes years to be translated?
     
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2017
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  4. cmec1

    cmec1 User

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    guys dont forget any new content that will be introduced for "new players" to catch up 200% will be abused by old ones, increase drop somewhere and 200% strong ones will control that area
    about changing engine of the game i would agree with it to reduce lag for all, but with everything thats gona be done for new players i cant agree cause u want it or not its gona be abused.. maybe some free 30d sets for higher than r grade yes, but if its concerned about farm well gl new players taking spots from old ones
     
  5. MrOurk

    MrOurk User

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    There are a lot of progressing ways and systems that can be implemented and at some point it will not be profitable enough for old players to just go and farm those places, it could be discussed in some other topic, but in short if you make it easier for new players to catch up and old / top players have way better ways of farming, they are not going to spend their time farming those (Making R/R95 gear easier to get dropped / spoiled could be one of the solutions)
     
  6. cmec1

    cmec1 User

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    do u rly think old ones would not exploit it?.. look at raids 92-93 // 97-98
    92-93 are controled by 2 ppl, 97-98 are controled by kenga..
    make drops higher of r/r95 there will be old players with pve poles farming those zones.. u can even look at pavel ruins, to farm there u need like 2b worth equip (ofc the better equip faster it would go but 2-3b is bare minimum(set 3x120, pole, 2rings crit dmg) and who farms there? only old ones, maybe some new guy come to try and guess what either he's pked there or some1 comes and steals his drops
     
  7. MrOurk

    MrOurk User

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    It's all about how you design the system, if it's well round you will not have those problems. Let's say you can make on lvl 92-93 hunting grounds around 15-20kk adena per hour if you farm properly and maybe old player would come and farm 100kk because he has the gear and knowledge to do so, if that player was getting 80-90kk adena per hour in a level 103 hunting ground + xp + factions progress in his main toon do you think he would bother with going to lower level area only to be able to have a chance of making 10kk more? I don't think so

    Why in old chronicles people didn't bother farming low level spots unless it's for some materials with some alt spoiler? Because those areas were giving enough money / materials for those lowbies to pay for their shots / next gear level but you didn't have enough drop/spoil to make it worth for endgame player, those had their own areas to make more money to progress faster on the current gear they had, there were some exceptions of course but it was the general rule. It could be seen easier even with Ancient Adena drops, lvl 30-40 cata/necros were dropping seal stones to convert them to AA but they were very low amount, but still low people could make some extra adena from there to buy C grade gear let's say, but when you wanted top AA drops you were simply going lvl 70+ necro/catas and not bothering going on low level ones
     
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  8. cmec1

    cmec1 User

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    yes there is some truth, but the reason of nerfs in top (even in low zones) its because of bots, but there's also thing like overpowered characters, if u gonna make 700kk/h for party in superion(to match those 100kk/h in low zone), there will be very strong destros soloing it (lets say not full 700 but 500kk/h) and once again the spots will be controlled by old ones(fattest wallet owners), and yet we can count spots in all 101+ locations on 2hand fingers, that means from 50cp's those spots will be taken by 10, 40cp's will look after low zones, there is no win win situation

    semi solution to new ones to have some chances in playing would be paulina gear for 85-95-99 gear for 1 month, so they can save up their adena to normal sets, everything else gona be taken
     
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2017
  9. Aboriginal

    Aboriginal User

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    Innova restricts availability to obtain the free farm and promotes more pay to play content such as "premium account, tarots, caskets, brooches, p2win events, EXP boost and etc" it's just using Lineage 2 fans and exploits theirs seeks by making easy game money "Adena" making machine thro "L2 Store" majority of game promotions by Innova is involved in seeking to involve majority of people to pay for their needs instead of obtaining it by playing. This is a negative impact on the own game since even own game don't have such advantages obtaining in items as "L2 Store" however players minds are redirected to such view as "Game Feature" when it's a game breaker, by making unplayable conditions to obtain "L2 Store" convince people to take risky actions in the hope of a desired result. And for me in the game where are pixels and virtual nothingness and people that are spending 10 thousand of euros and more just to show how self-importance matter it's above absurd. Sometimes I ask myself I am playing a game or some kind of virtual ego feelings emulation express mind training programme. Make the game more free to play and stop these people mind cloning from one to another with this p2win stuff by promoting pay to play content in use of addiction of game.
     
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2017
  10. Naito

    Naito User

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    We can speak and speak and speak and nothing will change. Why i can simply show you.
    There is two options for Innova.

    1. The first one, better for the players:
    5000 active players with an active premium account 7 euro + some small monthly donations +- 15 euro per person.

    5000 * (7+15) = 110 000 euro incomings.

    2. The second option which Innova preffer:
    300 active players with an active premium account 7 euro + big monthly donations +- 400 euro per person.

    300 * (7+400) = 122 100 euro incomings.

    [ my prices and incomings are just theoretical to clearly show the differences, didn't say, that Innova have them on same level ]

    The profit for the company is almost same, even better. Also less players means less costs for server infrastructure, less people to employ for the support asstiance, less players means less problems for the small company like Innova is.

    So the conculsion is, that all we have now isn't easy to change for Innova, even very hard to change. First of all they need much much more population to switch for option 1, also they need to take a risk, and change game model from donate > ingame profit to ingame profit > donate. It means incomings from the donations will drasticly go down in the first months, it brings more players, so they need to change infrastrukture, employ more people to the support and at the end, they don't have a guarantte, that this changes let them keep same incoming like they had before. It's a very big risk. Also if this operation will fail, the company also drown. So to end this post, maybe they really wanna do something, but this is not so easy like it looks, also this is not theirs game, they are depended from NCSoft and do not have posibility to make this game as they really want and need. This is another great unknown, so having all this in mid for sure no one decide to change anything if now is good enough.
     
    Last edited: Apr 27, 2017
  11. Jimmydix

    Jimmydix User

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    Aboriginal: I couldnt agree more. This game turned into casino game.
    Without changing this main issue I see really no point discussing other dissfunctialities of the game engine.

    Even if I decide to buy some chest or random pack for EURO I get 0 information what % chance I have for getting items from it. In casino you have ways to estimate your win/loose propability.
    Here? You have NO CHANCE to calculate your sucess without information of the % propability from the company. What if it is only 0,00001 % chance for item you look for?? For me its shocking that such system can be legal.
    I consider this reply relevant since its related to game operator - user communication.
     
  12. iFilda

    iFilda User

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    The problem with this is that probably all game mechanics like enchant etc is on the same principle and is unknown for other people than developers. If they reveal the chances and mechanic behind it, it will also apply for non donate items and that is what they don't want for sure.
     
  13. Jimmydix

    Jimmydix User

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    I dont know if there was ever enough pressure from players to reveal the chances or everyone trying to make things more transparent hit the "only developers know how it works" argument wall and thats it. I would survive the information embargo on game mechanics that is not related to items purchased for real money through L2 store.
    But purchased items from L2 store should definately have added information about rates of success - like for expample chest that upon opening give item from the list. On the list there should be not only list of items but whats their % chance to appear. coz normaly when you buy something for money or even gamble in casion you know your % chance.
    Ofcourse Iam sure that if they reveal the chances the people wouldnt buy - but giving no information I call a rip off.
     
  14. MrOurk

    MrOurk User

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    Giving no information it's literally scamming, since you're paying for a product you don't know what you're going to get from, problem is it's dark zone from law in the inet, but in example goverments like China made it to be forced to tell chances to custommers when buying anything online, so in this case it applies also to L2 l2store chances from China
     
  15. cmec1

    cmec1 User

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    for u its 50/50.. its either u get what u wanted or not.. simple as that
     
  16. Jimmydix

    Jimmydix User

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    50/50 :D I would say 1 to 5000000000000000000000000000000000000 or somewhere in the middle
    Apr 28, 2017
    anyway I dont want to go too far, Iam not a judge nor jury but hey if its legal then at least its immoral and if someone ask me or community what I think then this is no.1 problem for me thats pi**ing me off not some stupid entry problem to kartia.
     
  17. mYzor

    mYzor User

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    Two things:

    People need to understand its not up to the Comunity Manager to answer most of this stuff.
    Questions? Search the forum. No results? Make a Thread. If there is no help, send a private message to a Forum Mod. If he cant help you, then HE/SHE is the one to reach the Community Manager.
    Suggestions? Search the forum. No results? Make a Thread. Then, if the CM is doing his/her job, then he/she will read it.
    Reports (bots, spammers): Support is there for that.

    ********* Time (sorry :p): You may like to talk to us, but at the moment i believe its better to spend some time listening to the comunity instead. The Community Manager is the only way players get to be heard by the higher ups. (even if Inova ends up not beeing able to do anything)
     
  18. __JTB

    __JTB User

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    The problem is that they are not forced to do anything. They can live with few negative posts on the forum, what matters to them is sales. Look at Ramona, peapole buying jewelery boxes, shirts, and xp boosts like there is no tomorrow. Look at Core, there is fishing event and there are plenty of baits on sale for adena, many peaple sitting with 10+ packs. So, until the cash flow is steady, they are not forced to do anything. If their income from L2store would significantly drop, then they would consider any suggestion, and make changes, but sadly it's not gonna happen.
     
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  19. mYzor

    mYzor User

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    Complains about Inovas business wont result in anything because from a business point of view, it works.

    Now, if Inova knows (thanks to the CM's work) that players are displeased about the "game" part of their business, they pretty much have 2 options:
    1: Ignore it until it becomes bad and then act. (and risk it becoming bad enough, to the point of no return).
    2: Pass along their comunity complaints to NCSoft, saving themselves from some of the flak that will come when the game shuts down.

    About the Opening Post, previous info about events is always nice. When they are SET to happen.
    Having the CM posting info about upcoming updates/patches i dont agree with. Things change too much, like the thing that happened with the possibility of upgraded boss jewels (or something like that) on NCWest. People started to stockpiling'em and then, that part of the update wasnt there.
     
  20. iziowner

    iziowner User

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    Very annoying fact ,to keep by Innova low level economy on new server(Ramon),everything in game is so expensive,so farmers can make good business selling adena,plus nothing interesting for players in L2 shop,only expensive supplies ,I fill screwed.and other players probably too.